Moyers/Wright Transcript

Bill Moyers' interview with Rev. Jeremiah Wright just concluded. Here are my notes:

Moyers begins by ackowledging Jeremiah Wright is a controversial figure, and that "Willie Horton style ads" are being run. He then talks about his personal connection to Wright. Apparently, back when Moyers was LBJ's press secretary, Wright was in operating room when President Johnson had gall bladder surgery. There is a photo of both of them together in the operating room. Wright claims the secret service wrestled him to the ground after the surgery, even though he was constantly in the operating room the entire morning. He said LBJ had to be awake and talking at 9 AM before the stock market opened, so there wouldn't be chaos.

More after the flip:

Moyers then asks, "Who is Jeremiah Wright?" A member of the Fellowship of the United Church of Christ. He then says the program will center on "The man, his ministry and the church." In '72 Wright became pastor of Trinity with an 87 member congregation. By the mid 80's, there were several thousand in his flock. Wright was featured on an '87 episode of "Frontline." He was instrumental in starting up soup kitchens, and drug counseling. He also stressed good role models for black kids, saying "You can't be what you can't see."

In '88, he baptized Obama. He's going to retire after 36 years as pastor. He also served a total of 10 years in the Marines & Navy. The motto of his church is "Unashamedly Black, unapologetically Christian."

Moyers asked Wright if he's "racist."

Wright responds, "No." He says blacks respond to culture. "We don't have only sacred music. We don't have to only use pipe organ.... or use correct diction. We have our own music tradition... God has diversity."

Moyers asks, "What does the church service mean to Black Americans?"

Wright says, "Hope."

He then quotes Psalm 27. That there's a better way in this life, it's not in vain. The marginalized move from hurt to healing. There is a balm in Gilead....We serve a God who cares about the poor. God says I'm with you.... Courage in the struggle for justice and peace."

Moyers then tackles "Black liberation theology."
He asks if this theology "reads the Bible thru people who have suffered." Is that a fair bumper sticker?

Wright talks about how the world has a history of oppression: Greek oppression, Roman, etc. etc.

Cut to one of his sermons:
"When govt lies, God does not lie.
When govt changes, God does not change.
When govt fails, God does not fail."

Moyers: "You could be crucified for saying that."
Wright: "Most people forget after MLK was assisinated, when he preached against Vietnam war, he was ostresized. Many thought he overstepped bounds... shouldn't talk about the war. "That part of MLKing isn't lifted up on his birthday."

Moyers: Why don't people want to hear the "Full Monty?"
Wright: "We are miseducated as a people. People don't want to hear the truth, but only what they're taught." "Condemned" - God condemning practices against God's people. Psalm 137 - How can we sing song in a foreign land?"

Wright: On Sept. 11, I was in Newark, I saw the 2nd plane hit. Lost loved ones at WTC, and Pentagon. Move from revolt to revenge -- because you want to kill babies. God wants redemption and wholeness. Sunday following 9/11. What is God saying, when people want revenge?

"Ameicans chickens are coming home to roost. We took this country by terror from Apraho, Navajo to build our way of east. We bombed Granada and killed innocent babies. Killed in Panama. Bombed Kadafi, killed unarmed civilians in Iraq.  We bombed Nagasaki, Hiroshima. We never batted an eye. And now we are indigent. It's brought back to our own front yards. Violence begs violgence. Hate begets hate. Terrorism begets terrorism."

Moyers: Did you have a failure of communication?

Wright: "What did they want to communicate?"

Moyers: How do people percieve you?

Wright: "As Unamerican, unpatriotic, filled with hate speech, that I have a cult and btw, guess who goes to his church? Hint hint hint."

Moyers: What can you tell me what happened at your church since controvery broke?
Wright: Our Church members are upset -- they know it's a lie. Press pick up our church bulletins
Calling sick and shut ins to get interviews...."

Moyers: Death threats?
Wright: Yes, and bomb threats at the church.

Moyers: Did you ever think you'd come to personify the black anger that whites fear?

Wright: No, it's very new and unsettling. ....Music is a part of our church. How do you give people hope? Through music tradition, ie, the blues. Antia Baker, Luther Vandross.

Moyers: What blues are you singing now?
Wright: "Don't nobody treat me so bad" I'm so glad trouble don't last always" And the story of Joseph in the Bible: "What man meant for evil, God meant for good."

Moyers: What does that mean?
Wright: Humans can do things under nefarious purposes, but God can turn that around. God can take sound bites and help nation comes to grips with miseducation...and things we don't like to talk about.

Moyers: Has Obama ever repeated your words?
Wright: No. I continued to be a pastor of God, concerned about the things of God

Moyers: Obama was a skeptic. You led him to the faith.  And yet he had to say some hard things about you.

Wright: He's a politican, and I'm a pastor.... I do what I do, he does what politicians do. He didn't disown me, because I was a pastor.

Moyers: What about your abrasive edges?
Wright: Farrakhan was responsible for getting kids off dope.... turning their lives around. We don't believe the same things, but that has nothing to do with how he helps people.  Like EF Hutton, when Farrakhan talks, people listen.

Noyers: Why do people continue to believe Obama is a muslim?
Wright: Fearmongering is why people think Obama is a muslim.

Moyers: United Church of Christ calls for a sacred conversation in race relations. How can we?
Wright: Use Bill Jones theology to see how we've come to see God through race. We have to start telling the truth in our schools.

Moyers ends thanking Wright for being on the program.

There you have it, folks. As best as I could transcribe. I'm sure the exact transcript will be online soon. Just wanted to give everyone a heads up.

UPDATE: Full Transcript is here: http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/04252008/transcript1.html

Display:


Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 10)

Tips for a transcript!


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 10:32:34 PM EST

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 1)

Well, he looked awfully warm, human and intelligent... certainly not what the Clinton supporters here were hoping for....


It profits a PUMA nothing to give their soul for the whole world... but for McCain? --Sir Thomas More (if he were here now)
by LordMike on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 10:41:47 PM EST

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 4)

Not to mention unapolgetic. Why did Obama renouce what he said?


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 10:45:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I love your signature. I'm a Lutheran... (2.00 / 2)

and I have a Messiah, too.  Probably the same as yours.


by CoyoteCreek on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 10:49:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

And here's a newsflash: (2.00 / 3)

It ain't Obama! LOL!


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 10:56:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Absolutely! (2.00 / 3)


by CoyoteCreek on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:14:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And here's a newsflash: (1.50 / 2)

You two jokers do understand that the only people who call Obama "messiah" are hyper-partisan Clinton supporters and Rush Limbaugh and his ilk.

Nobody who supporters the political candidacy of Barack Obama has called him "messiah".


by bawbie on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:46:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And here's a newsflash: (2.00 / 1)

Better run and tell that to Timothy Noah over at Slate:

The Obama Messiah Watch
http://www.slate.com/id/2158578/?nav/navoa/


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:06:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And here's a newsflash: (none / 0)

Should we take their Death Watch of Clinton as seriously?


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:38:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And here's a newsflash: (2.00 / 1)

No, unless you agree they're all "hyper-partisan Clinton supporters and Rush Limbaugh and his ilk."


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:47:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And here's a newsflash: (none / 0)

Please explain.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:49:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And here's a newsflash: (2.00 / 1)

See above.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 04:16:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And here's a newsflash: (none / 0)

Yeah still doesn't make sense though I assume you agree that neither term is seriously used.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 09:59:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And here's a newsflash: (none / 0)

I agree that folks who use the term "messiah" to describe Obama aren't "hyper-partisan Clinton supporters and Rush Limbaugh and his ilk."


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 06:24:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And here's a newsflash: (none / 0)

Do you  think the people who use that term are serious about it? You think people think Obama is a biblical messiah?


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 10:57:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 0)

From what I saw, once Wright's comments were in context, there wasn't much to renounce him for.  

I like Obama's brand of politics, but I'm not silly enough to not realize that politics forced him to give that speech.  Maybe this was intellectually dishonest of him, but I think he was renouncing the YouTube public perception of Wright.  It's unfortunate.

But really, I would like to hear what you thought about the interview.  I'm an Obama supporter and am not very objective about this matter.  

I know you are a Clinton supporter - what did you think of Wright?


by emptythreatsfarm on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:24:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 4)

I think he made a wise decision to retire.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:26:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 0)

Why?  Which of his comments did you find so offensive that they merited the treatment he has received?


by emptythreatsfarm on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:33:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 2)

Let me ask you: What treatment did he recieve that wasn't merited by his inflammatory remarks?


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:44:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 0)

All of it.  including the denouncement by Barack Obama (although I understand why it was politically necessary).

As a pastor to his parish, Jeremiah Wright did nothing wrong.


by bawbie on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:47:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 2)

Wright suggesting the terrorist attacks of 9/11 were payback for American policy was correct? Wright claiming the US government spread HIV in black communities was correct? Wright calling on God to damn America was legit?


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:52:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (1.00 / 1)

Wright didn't suggest that.

He was quoting a general speaking on Fox News, and then playing off of that thought.

You really don't do context, do you?


by bawbie on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:54:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 3)

Then your beef is with Bill Moyers:

Bill Moyers: "Jeremiah Wright will be in Washington Monday for a news conference at the National Press Club -- his first since the controversy erupted over those incendiary sound bites. You've heard them; who hasn't heard them: Wright suggesting the terrorist attacks of 9/11 were payback for American policy; Wright repeating the canard heard often in black communities that the u.s. government spread HIV in those communities; Wright seemingly calling on God to damn America."


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:02:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (1.00 / 1)

But furthermore, why and how are you so God Damn moral that you can judge how this man preach to his parish?

Personally, I would feel just awful if I were as judgmental as you.  What people do in church is between them, their faith community and God (breaking of laws excepted).  You butting your head into their faith is just unacceptable in the Democratic party I believe in.


by bawbie on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:57:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 3)

He can preach whatever he wants to; it doesn't bother me. However, it does appear to bother a whole lot of Democratic voters.

Nevertheless, I do believe his church, which is currently under investigation by the IRS, will lose its tax exempt 501(c)(3) status based on Wright's actions.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:07:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (1.00 / 1)

Than what does bother you?  Just up thread you were listing all the troublesome things Wright said, but they don't bother you?

Actually, since Obama's polls numbers haven't gone down at all since Wrights comments "broke", I'd say not all that many voters are "bothered" at all.

From my perspective, only hyper-partisan Clinton supporters and Republicans are at all bothered by his comments.


by bawbie on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:10:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 1)

Obama's favorability ratings have been declining

<img src="http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pLYPNryKcVU1Vud9WwRj7KQ&oid=6&output=image">


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:38:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

you're either a liar or an idiot... (1.00 / 1)

i'll repeat what i've told you REPEATEDLY when you pronounce this bullshit:

the ucc denomination is not under irs investigation for anything that wright did, and his church (trinity ucc).  given the fact that you've repeated this lie, i'm fairly certain you're not at all christian or you have no actual understanding what christianity says.  well, the latter is obviously true regardless of whether or not you think you are christian.

frankly, you embarrass methodists and methodism immensely...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 07:51:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Pay attention to the news (2.00 / 1)

According to the Wall Street Journal:

"Trinity's national parent, the United Church of Christ, recently disclosed that it's being investigated by the Internal Revenue Service for a speech Sen. Obama gave to 10,000 people at a church conference in June in Hartford, Conn., in which he mentioned his candidacy and parts of his platform, namely health-care reform."

Obama Pastors' Sermons May Violate Tax Laws
http://online.wsj.com/public/article/SB120511457633523621-jt3tKeinOKtip77kposjx14OHI0_20080408.html?mod=tff_main_tff_top


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:30:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Actually it's called Blowback not Payback. God literally Damns nations. That's how preachers talk. MLK said God would punish America. As far as the HIV goes (Bill Cosby said the same thing), after there's a few posts here about the government sponsored scientists spreading toxic sludge in African-American neighborhoods to experiment on the children you really see no reason for the paranoia?


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:40:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

one would know this only if one actually observed (none / 0)

a preacher.  this person clearly has not.  he's probably what we call a "social christian," someone who identifies with a particular church because he wants to be part of a community, not because he's religious or has any clue what his religion stands for.

rev. wright actually stands well within the mainstream of united methodist preachers, and even more so within the mainstream of black united methodist preachers.  they also quote other people saying really bad things.  but one would only know this if one actually pays attention...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 07:56:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wrigjt is not mainstream (none / 0)

>wright actually stands well within the mainstream of united methodist preachers,

The United Methodist Church does not believe that terrorist attacks of 9/11 were payback for American policy, that the U.S. government spread HIV in black communities or any other extremist view held by Rev. Wright.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:55:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 0)

I asked first.


by emptythreatsfarm on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:49:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 2)

People judge Wright by his inflammatory words, and they formed an opinion, as everyone has a right to do.

I live in the same city as Rev. Fred Phelps. He uses a lot of inflammatory language, and he's not well liked or respected. Few would say he didn't deserve the public perception he's earned.

>Which of his comments did you find so offensive that they merited the treatment he has received?


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:00:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

That's because even if you take Fred Phelps quotes out of context, it doesn't distort his message.

As he has proven time and time again, his message IS about soundbites.

Wright on the other hand, is a very learned man, and a respected biblical scholar preaching at a church under a very mainline American denomination.

Those soundbites all over YouTube distort his message.


by emptythreatsfarm on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:04:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 2)

Respectfully, you don't know much about Rev. Fred Phelps. He was a respected civil rights attorney with an amazing record of winning his cases for many, many years. He likewise was a very learned man with a doctorate, and preached in a Baptist church.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:15:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Yes, but I have read full transcripts of his sermons and all the talk about God punishing America for the iniquity of allowing homosexuality is reflected pretty accurately in his media soundbites.  He uses those inflammatory soundbites and other antics to draw media attention to his cause.

I also think it is disingenuous to compare Phelps with the Wright situation.  While he might have been respected at one time by this theological peers, I challenge you to find one mainstream pastor today that will support what he has become.

Many mainline pastors, even those for whom Black Liberation Theology is a fairly alien concept, have come out in support of Wright.


by emptythreatsfarm on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:29:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Likewise, I have read full transcripts of Wright's sermons and all the talk about God punishing America for the iniquity of how we've treated minorities is reflected pretty accurately in his media soundbites.  He likewise uses those inflammatory soundbites and other antics to draw media attention to his cause.

I'm not comparing Wright's message with Phelps. Each has his own inflammatory message and style. I say they both have the reputation they've earned. I'm also not seeing a wellspring of support for Wright among my friends in seminary and in the pulpit.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:45:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

MLK said substantially similar things. Shall we take away his holiday?


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:42:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Respectfully, you probably have not had Phelps protest at the funeral of anyone you know. When Wright and his congregation start protesting at innocent people's funerals, then you'll have an apt comparison. Until then, trying to equate Wright with Phelps is pretty offensive.  


by jdusek on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:55:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Actually, living in Topeka, Kansas, Phelps regularly protests the funerals of people I know and love, and has protested at my own church numerous times, including Easter morning. His "God Hates America" rhetoric misusing the Scripture is every bit as offensive as Rev. Wright's "God Damn America." Hate speech is hate speech.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 03:02:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Well then you and I share an unfortunate connection, but we disagree on the offensiveness of Phelp's rhetoric. In my opinion, nothing Wright has said comes close to Phelp's comments.


by jdusek on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 03:14:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Hate speech is hate speech.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 03:34:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]

you really do not understand religion, do you? (none / 0)

god damn america is a very, very popular theme in american religion.  given your lack of knowledge here, let me simplify it for you.  have you ever heard of "hell fire and brimstone" preachers?  they are saying that god damns america for its/our sins.  not an uncommon theme at all.

you do understand that prosperity christianity is not a methodist thing, right?  the "america as the new jerusalem" is not accepted by united methodism, either.

and just so you understand, methodism doesn't believe that god sanctioned slavery, either.  methodism is a lot closer -- a lot closer -- to rev. wright's expression of theology than your comments.  a lot...  


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 08:07:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Of course. Axlerod was pulling the strings. (1.00 / 4)

Probably dressed him before he went in front of the cameras.

What did you expect?


by CoyoteCreek on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 10:49:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Of course. Axlerod was pulling the strings. (2.00 / 3)

What was particularly interesting to me what that he appeared to totally drop his dialect.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 10:55:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

of course... (none / 0)

your moronic caricature of wright was all in you head.  as you gain more knowledge, you see the error of your ways.

one presumes that you have a long way to go.  very rarely are people as open about their prejudices as your postings have been...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:04:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Sorry, but no dice (2.00 / 4)

And nice Dick Morris quote on your sig line. Now there's a credible source! LOL!


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:11:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

i understand... (none / 0)

i can lead you to the truth, but i can't force you to accept it.

you'll understand why i am forced to correct your repeated lies and errors, though.  your embarrass my faith, methodism's theology and our collective creeds...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 08:09:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Actually (none / 0)

It's the other way around.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:59:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You mean like Michelle and Barry put on (1.50 / 2)

when they're in front of an AA rally?

So Rev. Wright talked straight this time?


by CoyoteCreek on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:15:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You mean like Michelle and Barry put on (2.00 / 2)

It was really odd to see such a contrast, especially after viewing so many of his inflammatory sermons. It was like he was a completely different person.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:21:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You mean like Michelle and Barry put on (2.00 / 1)

I don't know why this would be an odd contrast; preachers don't preach sermons with the same cadence or tone they use during polite conversation.  Mick Jagger doesn't strut around like a peacock when he gets off stage after a performance.  


by davisb on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:30:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Strutting like a peacock yes, but (2.00 / 1)

Folks from the South don't usually totally drop their accent when they travel up north, and vice versa. When I go travel to Boston, I don't suddenly ask people to paaaark my caaaar.

It was just peculiar, that's all. It's obviously something he can turn off and on at the drop of a hat.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:37:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Strutting like a peacock yes, but (none / 0)

I didn't pick up on any change of accent, phonetically he seemed entirely consistent.  The difference seemed to be in delivery and cadence.

That said, it wouldn't be out of the question; though I now live in Brooklyn and have lost my Boston/Braintree accent, when I go back home it only takes about 20 minutes with some high school friends over a couple of pints of Sam Adams before I'm ready to pahk my cah in Hahvahd Yahd.  

Phonetic adaptation and adjustment like that is normal.  I just don't see it here with Wright.


by davisb on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:43:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Strutting like a peacock yes, but (none / 0)

Both Clintons use speaking accents tailored to their audiences.


by haystax calhoun on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 07:04:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Axelrod's involvement (2.00 / 2)

Also, with <b>FOUR</b> appearances in a four-day time period, that's a full-fledged media blitz. Axelrod did quite an orchestration.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:07:08 PM EST

this guy just doesn't quit (2.00 / 2)

and seems like he wants Obama to lose. He could said, instead of accusing Obama of politics, could have said "I'm sure he does disagree with me, we disagree a lot"


"there is nothing wrong with America that cannot be cured by what is right in America"-William Jefferson Clinton, forty-second President of the United States
by DiamondJay on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:07:26 PM EST

Re: this guy just doesn't quit (2.00 / 1)

He didn't accuse Obama of "politics", although there would be anything wrong with that.  Obama is a politician after all.

What he said is very very simple.

he was asked if he'd ever heard Obama repeat his "controversial" lines, and his answer was basically:

No, I do the religious thing, and he doesn't advise me on that.  He does the politics thing and I don't advise him on that.  They live in two separate realms, so to speak.


by bawbie on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:51:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 0)

Can you guys make up your minds, was this orchestrated by the Obama camp, or is Wright off the leash, seriously you can't have t obth ways.

Hey, here's a thought maybe what Obama and virtually every major religious figure in America has said is true and Wright is a great but flawed man who can't be summed up in 30 seocond soundbytes?


by Socraticsilence on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:12:31 PM EST

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 2)

Who said Wright was off his leash?

Wright is certainly an interesting man with shockingly extreme views. But a "great" man? No.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:16:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Todd said it. Extreme views? His views are shared by  such well known extremists as Martin Luther King Jr. and Bill Cosby.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:43:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Then why did Obama repudiate Wright's remarks?


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:57:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

The HIV stuff doesn't appear to have a scientific basis. The crude remarks were just unnecessary. Which remarks did Obama repudiate exactly?


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:00:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]

When there are 100 :30 sound bites... (1.16 / 6)

the sum total is a lot more than a sound bite.

Rev. Wright is a very angry black man.  And it shows.


by CoyoteCreek on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:17:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: When there are 100 :30 sound bites... (1.00 / 1)

You seem to be the one that is angry.

You keep shooting off your mouth without looking at the whole picture and condemning a man because you've heard some quotes out of context.

What is it that you are angry about?


by emptythreatsfarm on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:52:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: When there are 100 :30 sound bites... (1.00 / 2)

You are a despicable human being.

And it shows.

No intelligent person could possibly have watched that interview tonight and come away with that perception.  It's just not possible.


by bawbie on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:52:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Thank you for your kind words. (2.00 / 2)

I am so far from being despicable, I have to laugh.

But keep saying it.  I'm sure you feel better as a result.

Good luck!  You'll need it!


by CoyoteCreek on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:11:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Thank you for your kind words. (2.00 / 2)

Right.  You are a wonderful person.  Thanks for pointing out that the angry black man probably didn't even dress himself.  



Lost rate and rec for issuing a '1' to a trollish comment. The troll, not so much.

by map on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:14:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Thank you for your kind words. (2.00 / 0)

Similarly, I have to laugh when you call Rev. Wright and "angry black man".

If you can judge his character from watching a YouTube clip, then I have no problem judging your character from your comments in this thread.

See you silly it is?


by bawbie on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:22:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Thank you for your kind words. (none / 0)

No, you're pretty awful. Your last screen name referenced a mass murderer.


If you're being chased by an angry bull and then you notice you're also being chased by a swarm of bees, it doesn't really change things. Just keep on running.
by vcalzone on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:46:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

??????? Time for you to go to sleep (2.00 / 1)

as you are obviously dreaming.  What "last screen name"?


by CoyoteCreek on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 09:47:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: ??????? Time for you to go to sleep (none / 0)

John Wesley Hardin? Another commenter noted that you used the fairly unique expression "sad. So sad" in one of your last posts. Earlier, it was noticed that about three or four of the same users, ones who constantly baited and spewed anger all over the place, all used that phrase. I would have thought you'd have learned to not USE that phrase after being outed before, but clearly you haven't. Because here we have another commenter constantly baiting and spewing anger that ALSO uses that phrase.


If you're being chased by an angry bull and then you notice you're also being chased by a swarm of bees, it doesn't really change things. Just keep on running.
by vcalzone on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 11:40:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

No. I'm not John Wesley anything. (none / 0)

I don't know if John is truly a man, but I am truly a woman.

And if I use the same words as s/he, that is simply a coincidence.


by CoyoteCreek on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:41:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

BTW, I'd appreciate an apology. (none / 0)

I am not despicable and I have no idea about a mass murderers.


by CoyoteCreek on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:43:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: BTW, I'd appreciate an apology. (none / 0)

It's OK. Many Obama supporters on this site seem to resort to ad hominem attacks when they can't logically defend their positions.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:01:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No. I'm not John Wesley anything. (none / 0)

I think I KNEW you were female, too, which makes me feel colossally stupid. I'm sorry. Sometimes it's easy to get stupid on here.


If you're being chased by an angry bull and then you notice you're also being chased by a swarm of bees, it doesn't really change things. Just keep on running.
by vcalzone on Thu May 01, 2008 at 01:09:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Well isn't that (2.00 / 1)

"sad, so sad"

That is all I will say.


Student Guy=JoeMentum. No really Student Guy=JoeMentum, after all JoeMentum was an embarrassment so is Student Guy. This sig is FAIL!!
by Student Guy on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:52:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (1.80 / 5)

Agree. He made it appear that Obama was nothing but a political hack who would say and do anything to get elected.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:13:59 PM EST

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (1.50 / 2)

You are even more wrong than usual on this one.


by bawbie on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:52:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 2)

Seems pretty clear. According to Wright:

"[Obama] says what he has to say as a politician.... He does what politicians do."


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:28:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 3)

He's talking about how Obama's approach to racial problems differs from his; how Obama uses the language and tools of politics, while he uses the language of God and the tools of a religion.

The context of those two quotes was the difference between Obama addressing race in his speech and Wright in his preaching, "doing what he has to do as a politician" not in the sense of "doing what he has to do to get elected" but "doing what he has to do to address these social concerns."  He's only saying what you think he's saying if we assume the word "politician" means "lying opportunist" and not "person who work in politics."

The fact that we automatically assume the word "politician" is meant pejoratively says a lot about the state of our political discourse today.


by davisb on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:35:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 0)

Well said.

Not that it will go anywhere here.  Waaay too much reason.


by bawbie on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:48:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Wright "uses the language of God?" Can you show me where any of his incendiary remarks comport with the Scriptures? He certainly uses the tools of religion, but to what end?

Wright said tonight that Obama did what was politically expedient, as a typical politican. You may lament the state of our political discourse, but Wright was honest enought to call a spade a spade.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:37:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 1)

He said nothing of expediency nor did he describe him pejoratively as a "typical politician."  That's a false and out of context interpretation what he said (talk about the sorry state of our political discourse).

Those quotes came in the context of describing the contrasting styles between Obama's speech on race and Wright's preaching on race; Wright speaks about race using the language of the Bible (listen to the sermons, they are filled with Biblical references), Obama speaks about race using the language of politics.  Each "does what they have to do" giving their different jobs, audiences and venues.  

If Wright thought the speech was disingenuous, why did he vividly praise it for promoting a national dialogue on race?  If Wright saying Obama is a politician "doing what a politician has to do" was meant to imply he was being disingenuous and only trying to save his own electability, was he also implying the same about himself as a pastor when he said he was "doing what he has to do" as a pastor?  No.  You're misinterpreting what he said.


by davisb on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:51:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

"And so here at a political event, he goes out as a politician and says what he has to say as a politician." -- Jeremiah Wright on Obama.

It's your choice to interpret this pejoratively. It is what it is.

Obama hardly "praised" Wright's remarks. He subsequently said on the View:

"Had the Reverend not retired, and had he not acknowledged that what he had said had deeply offended people and were inappropriate and mischaracterized what I believe is the greatness of this country, for all its flaws, then I wouldn't have felt comfortable staying at the church."


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:33:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 1)

I don't think you read what I wrote.  

I DON'T think those comments were meant pejoratively, they were merely descriptive; Obama is a politician, so he gives political speeches at political events.  Wright is a Reverend so he gives religious sermons at religious events.  Neither is disingenuous.  That is the context.

And Wright praised Obama, not the other way around (I never said the converse).  In the Moyers interview, he described Obama's speech as God making good what men made evil.  He liked the speech, he didn't think it was disingenuous.


by davisb on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:41:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

You obviously didn't read what I wrote:

<blockquote>"And so here at a political event, he goes out as a politician and says what he has to say as a politician." -- Jeremiah Wright on Obama.

It's your choice to interpret this pejoratively. It is what it is.</blockquote>

As I said, the choice is yours.

Yes, Obama is a politican who gives political speeches. Likewise Wright also gives political speeches at religious events, which is why his church is under investigation by the IRS and may lose its tax exempt status.

You claim Wright "uses the language of God." If that were true, Obama would have had no need to repudiate Wright's political opinions about 9-11, HIV/AIDS and God damning America. Obama ultimately did, and Wright felt he did so because he's a politician.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 03:26:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

I really doubt you watched the interview having read your comment, or you just choose to be willfully ignorant


Bring Back MyDD - Just say No to Rec'ing Candidate Diaries.
by CardBoard on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 03:41:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

choose the latter... (none / 0)

it's much more likely to be the case.  he fits squarely into the political ideologies of where he lives.  he merely stands outside of the religious faith he appears to claim...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 08:12:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

You mean God doesn't Damn people and places in the bible? I bet God does...


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:02:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

indeed, he does... (2.00 / 1)

but knowing this actually requires that one have read and know the bible.  there is absolutely no evidence of such here.  he does not have a clue what methodism requires; he seems to have been training in religion by right-wing radio...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 08:13:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: indeed, he does... (none / 0)

Agreed.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 10:10:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

render undo caesar that which is caesars... (none / 0)

and undo god that which is god's.  for a start.  explaining the bible to you -- which you are in great need of, btw -- won't change your extreme prejudices, as i don't believe you care a wit about what scripture says.  wright's views are mainstream; your's are clearly outside methodism's...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 08:11:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: render undo caesar that which is caesars... (none / 0)

Thanks, but I don't need you to explain the Bible or United Methodism to me. It's clear you know  virtually nothing about either topic.

And that Bibilical quote is "unto" not "undo."


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:34:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 0)

You really seem to have a problem with both context and reading comprehension.


by bawbie on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:37:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

You seem unable to articulate any point without inflammtory insults.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:47:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 1)

The point has been articulated over and over and over again.  You just don't listen to it.


by bawbie on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 12:50:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 2)

Actually he said he never expressed agreement with those views that you  see as controversial and also said Obama is a politician not a preacher so he speaks in the language of a politician.

Like Russ Feingold. Or Abraham Lincoln. Or Paul Wellstone. Or Bobby  Kennedy. All politicians who speak truth in the language of politicians while Wright speaks the same truth in the language of a preacher.

But to be honest the failure to understand  Wright is not his failing it's yours.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:46:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

If Wright speaks the truth, why did Obama say this:

"I vehemently disagree and strongly condemn the statements that have been the subject of this controversy. I categorically denounce any statement that disparages our great country or serves to divide us from our allies. I also believe that words that degrade individuals have no place in our public dialogue, whether it's on the campaign stump or in the pulpit. In sum, I reject outright the statements by Rev. Wright that are at issue."


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:26:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Heheheh. When he's specific it's clear he's talking about the  crude statements Wright used. Other than that you have to assume you know what he's talking about.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 11:03:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 3)

Anybody who watched the interview I think has to be moved by what Dr. Wright said - I mean a lot of it was brilliant.  He did not, as the clips suggest, through Obama under the bus.  He supported liberation theology well.  He was elegant, thoughtful, and empathetic.  It was a great moment in Journalism.  Moyers did a fantastic job.


Bring Back MyDD - Just say No to Rec'ing Candidate Diaries.
by CardBoard on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:17:13 PM EST

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 2)

To the contrary, Moyers graciously gave Wright every opportunity to repudiate this inflammatory remarks. He stedfastly refused, and made things even worse with his "Louis Farakan is like E.F. Hutton. When Farakan talks, people listen" B.S.

It mades everyone wonder why Obama felt so compelled to repudiate Wright's remarks if everything he said was milk and cookies.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:24:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Did you watch the interview?  There is a reason why everybody who knows Rev. Wright has stood by him.  There is a reason the entire Religious and Theological Community has stood by him.  You are speaking about the "30 secondfied" Rev. Wright.


Bring Back MyDD - Just say No to Rec'ing Candidate Diaries.
by CardBoard on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:31:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 2)

"Everybody" has stood by him? Then why didn't Obama?

Seriously, I happen to know a lot of clergy in the Midwest. Not a single one has condoned his inflammatory remarks.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Fri Apr 25, 2008 at 11:42:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (2.00 / 1)

The UCC backed him. Fr. Pfleger defended him. Clinton's DC minister defended him. The new preacher at Trinity defended him.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:03:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

Links?


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:21:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

http://www.ucc.org/news/responding-to-wr ight.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/03/27 /pastor-of-clintons-forme_n_93681.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiSutcBAr DU
So did Huck:http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/03/19 /huckabee-defends-rev-jer_n_92346.html
John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 09:56:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

None of the sources you cite defend Wright.

The UCC didn't "back" him:

"Many of us would prefer to avoid the stark and startling language Pastor Wright used in these clips.... Not every pastor in the United Church of Christ will want to share Pastor Wright's rhetoric or his politics.  Not every member will rise to shout "Amen!"    

Father Pfleger, who got in trouble with the Cathloic church for saying "we're going to snuff out legislators who vote against our gun laws" has maxxed out contributions to Obama's campaign, and also defends Farrakhan. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49Uw1HzStiw

Snyder conceded in the YouTube video he did not agree with everything Wright said.

And Huckabee? Don't make me laugh.

>The UCC backed him. Fr. Pfleger defended him. Clinton's DC minister defended him.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 01:54:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

They all backed him. They don't have to agree with him to back him.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 11:07:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/17/us/pol itics/17wright.html?_r=1&oref=slogin


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 09:58:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moyers/Wright Transcript (none / 0)

This NY Times article reinterates that Obama denounced Wright's remarks.

"Mr. Obama denounced the remarks made in a church that he has attended over the last two decades and criticized Mr. Wright, who officiated at his wedding, baptized his children and served as his spiritual mentor."

If Wright's remarks were nothing but cookies and milk, why did Obama renounce them?


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Sat Apr 26, 2008 at 02:00:44 PM EST
[